He wanted to lead the question to the utilitarian question of "who is our common enemy, and what problems can be solved first to benefit the farmer the most".

To continue to fight for the issue of "equality and fairness", we will always be passive.

To deviate the problem is to turn the passive into the active, because the Mohist theoretical explanation is more reasonable with the Taoist theory of naïve contradiction...... The unfairness of the present is for the sake of fairness in the future, and you can communicate happily with Taoists like this, but you can't communicate with farmers like this.

Xu Xi was silent for a moment, and said helplessly: "It's because I don't pay taxes, don't do military service, and don't plough the land." However, the village community in Sishang has better farming tools than us, such as ear cutters, such as composting, such as more cattle and horses, such as quyuan plows......"

He was overjoyed, and since Xu Xi realized that there were problems with these two, he first asked: "So, where did the tassel harvester, the curved plow, the columb, the water drain, the wind mill, and the horse-drawn thresher come from?" The gentleman ploughs with the people, but he also needs iron tools, so can small farmers make iron tools from their crops? ”

The gentleman saw that the farmers in the Sishang Village were rich, far better than the Chu land, and even better than the thousand-person village community where the farmers tried the land of benevolence and righteousness. The problems you see with ear cutters, curved plows, and columbs can actually be boiled down to two problems. ”

"First, the division of labor. Second, grasp the will of heaven and borrow the Tao to benefit people. ”

Shi asked Xu Xi solemnly: "Regarding the division of labor, I will ask Mr. a question first. Can you use a sword? ”

Xu Xi's face was a little shy, and he replied cautiously: "Although I can use it, I don't have as many swordsmen as the Mo family." ”

Shi asked again: "Then the gentleman killed a hundred people with a sword, and those farmers who have been harvesting and occasionally holding a sword also killed a hundred people, who can kill faster?" ”

"It's me."

"So what does Si Shang think about picking cotton in one day, the hired workers who specialize in picking cotton, or the farmers who grow and pick cotton by themselves?"

"Those people who specialize in picking cotton in the village of Sishang."

"So, sir, do you think that now that you are going to do carpenter's work, you can do it faster than the worst craftsman in Sishang who has obtained a carpenter's certificate? The same car, are you doing it fast? Or is it the craftsman who does it quickly? ”

"It's a craftsman."

"So Mr. thinks that weaving is divided into 27 processes, such as flower picking, seed removal, carding, strip rubbing, spinning, worsting, weaving, and dyeing; Compared to planting and dyeing, everything is done by one person. Of the same hundred people, which side produces more cotton? ”

"It's the ones in front."

"So Mr. thinks that the three tables mentioned by Zi Mozi, that is, whether the total wealth of the world increases, whether the majority of people benefit, and whether the population increases, are they correct?"

"Mozi is a great talent, and what he said is three expressions, and my peasant disciples also think so."

Shi Shen said in a deep voice: "Since Mr. agrees with Zi Mozi's three rules, he will do something that violates these three rules. Zi Mo Ziyan: Those who are enough to repeat their words are often the same; If it is not enough to hold it, do not use it often. Not enough to hold it and often, and the mouth is also swinging; Enough to hold and inoften, pseudo-佽 also. Isn't it a hypocrisy and righteousness that the gentleman approves of these three rules, and instead of implementing them, he does them in the opposite direction? ”

Xu Xi was shocked and scolded angrily: "How can I be hypocritical and righteous? I recognize these three expressions, and I also want to benefit the people of the world, how can I be said to be hypocritical and righteous? ”

Shi asked, "Just like the question you had just about killing with a sword and a farmer killing with a sword, the farmer also needs iron, cloth, salt, and oil, all the necessities of life. Isn't it, then, that the division of labor makes each man produce more in a given time, and you want to oppose him, do you not want the sum of the wealth of the world to increase? ”

"You agree that the total value of the total wealth of geniuses in the three tables is the criterion for judging whether it is a benevolent and righteous government, but you oppose the increase of the total wealth of the world, what is this not a hypocritical villain? It's like you said that Shang Xuan is unbenevolent, but you are holding a sword to protect Shang Xuan, this is something you can't help but reflect. ”

"If you want to let the people of the world plough and eat together, and do not refine the division of labor so that people often think of it, how can you increase the total wealth of the world?"

"So I think that if your doctrine works in the world, it will harm the world."

The social division of labor increases the productive forces, which is the truth, which is the so-called Tianzhi of the Mohists.

The more detailed the division of labor, the greater the increase in production efficiency, which is the source of the division of labor.

Instead of talking about the fairness of the scissors gap between industry and commerce and agricultural products, he directly found loopholes in the farmer's model and kicked the ball to Xu Xi, forcing him to answer.

When Mencius debated with the peasants, he also avoided the issue of "fairness", and instead used the theory of "hard work" similar to the "social division of labor", but its essence was to promote his own doctrine, so that the hard work was reasonable - this sentence itself is not wrong, the fault is wrong in the era he said, and it did not solve the problem of blood nobility, and the laborer is bound to the feudal aristocratic class, and the laborer is equivalent to the feudal aristocracy, so if it is not wrong, it is wrong in the context of the times.

Appropriate is to use the social division of labor to refute Xu Xi, and at the same time tell Xu Xi why the social division of labor and why the social division of labor is right.

Hard work, that is a class attribute.

Similarly, the social division of labor also has a class attribute.

If the social division of labor is recognized, then the workshop system of the handicraft factory in Sishang is progressive, and it is the right means to increase the total wealth of the world, in other words, let the farmers of the Song Kingdom go bankrupt and work in Sishang...... True, to some extent.

And this reputation is better: you see, it was the nobles who had to annex the land for profit, not that our Mo family had to force the farmers to give up their land to work in the city and workshops, and we also took you into the run. The nobles are simply too bastards, in the future, everyone will get rid of the nobles together, okay? Anyway, the Mo family is now the opposition party in the world, and the nobles have to carry the pot, who will let Zhou Tianzi and the princes still be there.

If not, then it is necessary to refute the problem of differences in production efficiency brought about by the social division of labor.

Xu Xi couldn't refute in his heart, so he could only be silent, he faintly felt as if he had deviated from the debate, but he didn't know how to pull it back.

He dug a pit for Shi to jump into, but Shi jumped in and did not choose to climb out, but chose to dig up the ground around him, and then dug a pit again and pushed him in.

Seeing Xu Xi's silence, Shi immediately said: "This is like a steamed bun, divide and eat." The three tables of the Mo family are to make the steamed bread bigger and divide the steamed bread fairly. And Mr.'s approach is not to consider making the steamed bread bigger at all, but just thinking about the fairness of dividing the steamed bread, and even to give up the outer layer of the steamed bread for the sake of fairness, because that will lead to uneven distribution, is this the case? ”

This sentence is another pit.

But to Xu Xi's ears, this is simply a lifesaver, and in his opinion, a huge loophole has finally been revealed, and he can't help but be overjoyed in his heart.

If you continue to say what you just said, it will be difficult for me to get the debate back, but now that you suddenly say this, this is exactly what woke me up.

He immediately said, "What you said is exactly what I want to say." Mozi's three tables back then are what you mean. However, you only pay attention to making the steamed bread bigger, but you do not pay attention to the fairness of the distribution of the steamed bread, so that the industry and commerce benefit and the farmer suffers, which is the difference between our farmers and your Mo family. ”

Shi smiled and shook his head and said: "Sir, it's a big mistake, if today, it's not us who share the steamed buns, but the princes and nobles." ”

"The land is sealed to the feudal king, and the farmer has to serve labor, pay taxes, cultivate for the public, and repair for the feudal king. The nobles did not have enough crops, but they got a lot of food, and this is the person who divides the steamed buns. ”

"As for industry and commerce to get the blood and sweat of farmers, it is just a little bit of steamed bread."

"That's why I said, sir's truth can only benefit the world slightly, but not the world."

"It's like if one person kills someone, and the other person just doesn't sweep the dust in front of his house, and you kill the person who doesn't clean the dust, but you don't chase the person who kills the person."

"There is a priority in everything, shouldn't the question now be to kill the murderer first, and then to take care of the person who has not cleaned up the dust in front of his door?"

Xu Xi was silent again, and after a while, he said: "The person who kills is wrong, but it doesn't mean that the person who doesn't sweep the dust in front of his door is right." In the world, there is only right and wrong, not a small mistake is better than a big mistake. ”

Shi nodded and said: "There is nothing wrong with what Mr. said, there is only right and wrong in the world." However, if Mr. holds a sword to restrain the world, then Mr. is going to chase the murderer first? Or do you want to punish the person who doesn't sweep the dust in front of his door? ”

Xu Xi sighed: "I will chase the murderer first." However, when you say this, doesn't that mean that the Mohists also think that is also wrong? ”

Shi Liansheng nodded and said, "How can it not be wrong?" The farmers of Chu bought salt, the price of salt was extremely high, and the merchants sought profit and exploited the farmers, did the Mo family agree? ”

"Mr. is circulating in Si, and he also knows that the price of salt in Sishang is not lower than that of Chu? Isn't it even lower than the price of the thousand-person village community where Mr. is by the river? The salt industry is also profitable in Sishang, but even if it is profitable, it is still cheaper and more beneficial to the farmer than the gentleman's on the riverside, doesn't this prove that the gentleman is wrong? Whether it is beneficial or not, that is tested by practice, practice has proved that Sishang's means are correct and can benefit the world, while Mr.'s means cannot benefit the world. ”

"The price of salt is low, one is that Sishang has set the price of salt, which does not meet the 'full labor in exchange for full goods' as Mr. said, and you can still make a profit, but the price of salt is lower than that of Mr."

"The second is the division of labor and the will of heaven to borrow the benefits of the people, so that each skilled salt worker produces more salt."

Xu Xi had to admit it, but immediately retorted: "If this is the case, then the amount of labor equivalent to a pound of salt in Sishang is lower than elsewhere, so it should be lower, which is also correct." Why, then, could Sishang keep the price of salt even lower, so that farmers could exchange the same amount of grain for the same amount of labor? ”

Shi said with a smile: "This is because Sishang needs money to carry out education, establish more workshops, train more teachers, healers, and muskets and copper cannons for a huge army. ”

"Why? Because I want to benefit the world. ”

"Why do we have to have teachers, doctors, armies, and cannons to benefit the world?"

"Because the main reason for the suffering of the peasants is that the princes and nobles feed one person with ten thousand people, so it is necessary to reason with them with muskets and bronze cannons."

"Sir, in the state of Chu, that is a fief that the feudal monarch has set aside for you that does not need to pay taxes and labor. If Sir, if you can move the Son of Heaven, say that you can move Qi, Chuyan, Han, Zhao, Wei, Qin, Yue, Zhongshan, Song, Zheng, Bashu and other princes, and say that the feudal lords of the world have all given up their land and power to make the world unified, then naturally there is no need for muskets and copper cannons. ”

"But sir, can you speak?"

"That's why I say that there are priorities and priorities for the benefit of the world, and there are big and small benefits, and there are real benefits for the world and hypocritical benefits for the world...... We cannot but understand and grasp these truths. ”

"Mr. also has the heart of benefiting the world, and the farmer also has the ambition of benefiting the world, is Mr. unwilling to solve the world's great troubles with my Mo family? After the world's major problems are solved, let's solve the small problems you mentioned? With the same power, being big is beneficial to the world, and being small is beneficial to the world, and the effects obtained are different. What does the gentleman think? ”

"Don't you want to devote yourself to this vigorous cause that will benefit the whole world?"